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August 03, 2005

Twins vs. Vikings

Who has the loyalty of the majority of Minnesotans? The Twins or the Vikings? As you've probably already read, Mr. COD has written a great post on a surprising trend we have recently seen concerning Twins fans' antipathy for all things purple. Mr. COD himself has been on the receiving end of some Twins fans' rebukes towards both the Vikings and their fans. It all makes me wonder, why? Why do we see this kind of dislike from Twins fans towards the Vikings and why does it seem to be a one way street? I commented to Mr. COD:

"For some reason hardcore Vikings fans have no problem cheering for the Twins when appropriate, but I've noticed hardcore Twins fans do not reciprocate when it comes to the Vikings. I have never understood it."

I was a Viking season ticket holder for the past few years and I was at a game where it was announced that the Twins had captured the Central Division crown. As you might expect, the whole crowd cheered heartily for the Twins. It was great. However, I am of the opinion that if it was ever announced at a Twins game that the Vikings had won something (keep your jokes to yourselves!) I doubt this news would get the same reception. Why is that? Don't get me wrong, I think there would be some cheering, but not a whole lot, I would wager.

Mr. COD addresses some of the possible reasons in his post above. He includes the "Big Brother complex," "The Dome," and "Emotions," namely current emotions that have Twins fans feeling disgusted toward our baseball team and perhaps uncharacteristically vindictive. To expound on the Dome reason a little bit I do think a lot of Twins fans' dislike of the Vikings comes from the fact that the Twins share a facility with the Vikings, and the fact that the facility is a football field. No doubt about it. It is a tragedy and one which I have discussed ad naseum on these pages. There may be another reason, though, that COD doesn't discuss.

I honestly think a lot of Twins fans have a feeling of superiority. Baseball is not a contact sport. It may even be considered a gentleman's game. It is a game of overwhelming statistics, complex strategy, and thrilling luck. Baseball is also "America's pastime." Or at least it used to be. Football is blue collar. It is hard hitting, painful, and may even speak to our baser instincts. Kill. Blood. Hit.

Football is also much more popular. To be a baseball fan is truly something unique, and sadly it is becoming more and more unique nowadays. So, I can somewhat understand the hardcore baseball fan's dilemma. Football is encroaching on their turf, and they don't like it.

Speaking of which, as I'm sure you know, ESPN is doing a 50 states in 50 days promotion which highlights sports trends in all 50 states. And of course, Minnesota is a part of this analysis.

Concerning Minnesota's favorite sport, and based on over 25,000 votes, the breakdown is currently thus:

46.8% - Hockey
32.3% - Football
10.9% - Baseball
5.3% - Basketball
1.4% - Fishing
1.2% - Golf
1.0% - Auto racing
1.0% - Soccer

Nothing too surprising there. Hockey is pretty big here. Concerning Minnesota's favorite pro-team, though:

64.7% - Minnesota Vikings
16.2% - Minnesota Twins
6.5% - Green Bay Paclers
5.1% - Minnesota Wild
4.6% - Minnesota Timberwolves
1.8% - Chicago Cubs
0.6% - Chicago White Sox
0.5% - Dallas Stars

That is a huge margin. That is an "out-behind-the-woodshed" margin. The Vikings reign supreme in Minnesota to the point of almost making the Twins percentage look statistically insignificant (well, not quite). This is especially shocking when you look at the statistics for Wisconsin where you would expect the Packers to have a similar lead:

33.4% - Green Bay Packers
32.7% - Milwaukee Brewers
22.9% - Chicago Cubs
11.0% - Milwaukee Bucks

It appears that according to these statistics Minnesota has bigger football fans than the people in Wisconsin, and that Wisconsin has bigger baseball fans than Minnesota. I would have expected this to be the exact opposite.

So, in conclusion, given the Vikings dominance on the sports scene in Minnesota it may be more understandable why Twins fans feel a bit overwhelmed. Having said all of this, let me say that I am huge fans of both the Vikings and the Twins. I will always cheer for both (unless the Twins move to Vegas). And while I still don't quite fully understand why Twins fans are so anti-Vikings sometimes, I do believe the dominance of the Vikings over the local sports scene does help answer that question. Until next time ...

Posted by snackeru at August 3, 2005 12:45 PM | Sports | TrackBack popup

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Comments

Outstanding research! Some of those numbers are down right surprising and totally out of left field (whoa! a baseball analogy from a Vikes fan! May Babe Ruth strike me down!)

Thanks for adding to the discussion!

Posted by: Brian Maas at August 3, 2005 01:12 PM

Do they only allow Minnesotans to vote on the Minnesota page?

Posted by: bjhess at August 3, 2005 02:32 PM

Good question. I'm sure anyone can vote, as I voted on the Wisconsin page. So, in a way, this is maybe more indicative of people's impressions of the Minnesota sports scence than actual reality.

I don't think so, though. I think the majority of the 25,000 votes are from Minnesota, just like the majority of the people voting on the Nevada page are probably from Nevada. I'm thinking people vote on the state page that they care about or that they are from.

Posted by: Shane at August 3, 2005 02:38 PM

An observation on Twins vs. Vikes:

Vikings fandom is more social, particularly since the Dome. You used to be able to see tailgaters at both Twins and Vikings games (though far more at Vikes games, simply because they played fewer games and thus tended to draw more per game). But even these days, when pretty much every game is on TV, people will get together for a Vikes game - I did it with friends during the 1999 season, for instance.

Twins fandom is also social, but only to a point. I've found that getting into a conversation about the Twins often, and often very quickly, leads to a pointed question: how many games have you been to this year? If you haven't been to more than a handful, you get dismissed as a 'fair weather fan'. Again, I think that's just part of the baseball mindset, but probably more pronounced here than in other places, because there isn't as long of a tradition of baseball fandom.

Just my $0.02US.

--
David Wintheiser

Posted by: David Wintheiser at August 4, 2005 02:24 AM

I was at a Sunday Twins game when they posted updates of the Vikings score, and I recall there were cheers as they went ahead.

Unfortunately, I was also at a Vikings PRESEASON game while there was a key pennant-drive Twins game taking place (it was late August 2003). Not once did they bother to post any score or update on the scoreboards, much less make any announcement. Rather, they kept scrolling the NFL stats leaders FROM THE PREVIOUS SEASON.

I think the Vikings themselves view the Twins with plenty of disdain -- the example above, plus the whole Dome situation. The Vikings need to build more luxury seats? Fine -- let's do construction in left field during baseball season. The Twins are tired of playing baseball on cement? Okay, we can get new turf -- but not too much like grass because we don't want our receivers to lose speed. Plus, the fact the Mike Lynn still gets 10% of luxury box revenues and the Twins get nothing is WRONG.

Additionally, virtually every local sports commentator (KFAN's the worst) can debate the merits of Vikings 7th-round draft picks (and worse - Packers 7th-round draft picks), but they often struggle to name Twins regulars in their oh-so-brief Twins discussions. Perhaps this is dictated by fan interest -- they are catering to predominantly Vikes fans -- but for the few Twins fans left, it's hard not to get a little peeved.

Whew. I'm done.

Posted by: spycake at August 5, 2005 04:38 PM

Good comments, spycake.

I like basketball, but don't closely follow the Wolves; whether they are good or bad, I'm not affected much. I know very little about hockey, and most of what the Wild do is off my radar; I'm only affected by the Wild if I want to eat in downtown St. Paul on a game night. I'm indifferent to Gophers sports, too. If those programs won a title, I might get swept up in the feeling of civic pride, but otherwise I don't really care about them.

I don't care much for football anymore, either. However, I actively dislike the Vikings. It makes me happy when they lose.

I get sick of the way they dominate local media coverage year-round. Even on the Twins flagship station, WCCO, I've heard Vikings chatter dominate talk shows in the spring and early summer, after an exciting Twins win, while the Twins were on top of the division or in the thick of the race. That gets really old. And every year, the Vikings get endlessly hyped, while the media seems to have a cynical view of all things Twins.

The Vikings killed Korey Stringer (yes, IMO, they're responsible for his death), there are sexual assaults at Winter Park, a player is arrested for drunken driving, the team's leading rusher gets caught in an airport with "The Whizzinator" and will miss the season for violating the NFL drug policy a third time, the head coach is busted for scalping Super Bowl tickets, the owner was a cheap opportunist who threatened to move the franchise, and that's beside the usual drama surrounding Randy Moss while he was with the team. Yet it all sort of seems to slide off the franchise. Despite the disappointing results on the field, the Vikings are still treated like the boys who can do no wrong. There's only so much of that Kool-Aid I can swallow before the gag reflex kicks in.

Posted by: frightwig at August 7, 2005 11:12 PM